Sorry, but this dude comes off as a total ****ing, delusional unrepentant, jealous, homophobic self loathing dweeb, devoid of any empathy for another human being.
Bad move by his lawyer, trying to make him out as the "victim".
The ABC interview, although terribly softball, was interesting. So much misinformation went through the media about this event.
Did I catch them saying something about Clementi's parents being...somewhat unsupportive about his coming out? He seemed like a very closed-off, lost soul from the get-go.
Also, I didn't know that the decision for Ravi to not offer condolences to the Clementi family was solely the attorney's decision. To that I say: WHAT??!!
He's an a-hole and dangerously naive, but 10 years in prison? No. I don't think he deserves 10 minutes in prison. I just don't think this was a hate crime, not at all. The idea that a bunch of sheltered-looking eighteen year-old kids getting freaked out, stunned, and gossipy over their roommate bringing home an older stranger he met on the internet is...well, I don't know what it is, but its not unusual.
Its a struggle, because I do think he should be punished...but I don't think jail time should be in the cards. I hate to say it, because I do think this kid is a douche, but I hope he gets his appeal.
Did I catch them saying something about Clementi's parents being...somewhat unsupportive about his coming out?
I thought I had read that somewhere, but I'm not really sure. I know he had an older brother who is openly gay.
Whether it was a hate crime, I still don't know, but the IMs in that were in that New Yorker article suggest Ravi was fixated on the fact that Clementi was gay before he even met him.
His brother James is younger and is enrolled up here at Skidmore College. I have no idea if he was out around the same time as Tyler. I have read the father was more receptive to Tyler coming out but not his mother, well at least not first. But that is based on what Tyler talked to on message boards and IMs, I am unsure if he disclosed if that relationship changed.
I found even in the short clips online of Ravi to be attorney-orchestrated, rehearsed, curt answers to questions that people want more than short sentences on, like him possibly having an issue with a gay roommate. It seemed any reference about Tyler that Ravi disclosed to people on the internet was about Tyler's sexuality. I find it hard to believe it he was not a little uncomfortable with it.
I can respect Bill's opinion on hate crime laws, but his comments about it just being a college prank tell me that he doesn't really fully grasp the shame, humiliation, and fear that Clementi was probably feeling. Maher & Sullivan argue against hate crime laws
They're both symbols now. Tyler is the symbol for every gay person who has ever been murdered or viciously physically attacked and Ravi is the symbol for every bully who has violently attacked somebody for their perceived difference.
Exactly, Namo. And it makes it so much easier to dig in and try to find the culprit in our blame-obsessed culture. People just need to get over the martyr/villain melodrama and look at both of these rather sheltered kids for who they are/were.
And, frankly with so many people involved who appear to be completely full of s**t (including the jurors, the lawyers, and frankly Clementi and Ravi themselves), I don't know if that will ever happen.
I.m not quite sure what your sheltered comment means either. Clementi was "Sheltered" his parents sort of gave him a hard time for being gay (specially his mother). How was he, "Sheltered"?
I'm actually more curious about Ravi's alleged sheltering. Nothing in this story has given that impression that either of them were that sheltered.
I also just watched that 20/20 interview. I just can't feel any sympathy. According to Ravi, everything he did in connection to this has been misrepresented. Tweeting before he even met his new roommate "F- my life. He's gay" was just how he was telling his friends Tyler was gay. It didn't mean anything. Jeez! When he told Molly to lie to the police he wasn't thinking! When he tweeted "It's happening again" in regards to Tyler getting it on with a "really weird" and "mean" looking guy again, he was just kidding around. He never meant anything about anything! I take everything he said in that interview a grain, nay, a big old deer lick of salt.
Maybe saying they were all sheltered was presumptive on my part. I just don't think the majority of eighteen year-olds know f**k all about the world, and gay folks in particular.
I just feel like people are expecting Ravi to have behaved as if he was a full-blown sophisticated and enlightened adult in this situation. "F**k my life. He's gay" is being treated like this damning, violent statement when I really don't think it is terribly far from what any straight 18 year-old boy would say if he found out his brand new roommate was gay. Ditto Clementi's "Dunkin Donuts" statement. These are just dumb little kids mouthing off to other dumb little kids.
Sympathy? Well, I'm not really there yet. Like I said, I do think punishment is in order, just not this punshment.
I had to stop watching the interview, because Ravi annoys me so much--and this is going to sound like I'm defending him, which I'm absolutely NOT, but...what keep nagging me is this:
I feel like we've had to put up with so many situations, over the years, in which vicious homophobes with genuine hatred in their hearts deliberately inflicted acts of horrific violence against gay men or women or trans people--and we've always wanted justice to be done. We've always wanted the system to punish them for their hatred and for acting on their hatred with violent acts.
And in the end, all we get is this: An asshole commits a series of stupid, mean-spirited acts, which end up pushing a gay kid toward a horrible suicide...and he gets the punishment the others escaped: 10 years in jail and, oooh! maybe we can even send him back to whatever backward country he must have come from, because no REAL American would ever have done this! Oh, no!
So no one punishes the homophobes. No one does anything about the people who taunt and tease and beat up gay men and lesbians and trans people. Ravi is treated like the most horrible person--the ONLY horrible person--and all the haters get to go on taunting and beating us up and calling us fags and dykes and trannies.
Ravi--who doesn't deserve this seeming defense--gets to be the scapegoat so that the people who have always dehumanized us can go on dehumanizing us.
He hasn't gotten ten years in jail yet, though. There's been no sentence.
No one does anything about the people who taunt and tease and beat up gay men and lesbians and trans people.
Isn't that part of the point of hate crime legislation? Whether or not it serves its actually purpose I don't know. It's just hard for me to just sweepingly say that there shouldn't be a deterrent to bias-related crimes. But I understand the argument against them. Is there another solution to getting the message out that targeting people for their sexuality or their race or their gender (or whatever negative assumptions another makes about the race, gender, sexuality, etc of another) isn't going to be tolerated? Does not having hate crime legislation send a tacit message that that kind of bias intimidation WILL be tolerated?
Everything I've read makes me believe that Ravi's main reason for doing anything regarding Clementi was because he was gay and the jury seems to be of that mind, too. I don't know how conviction of hate crimes works because I've never lived anywhere with hate crime legislation, so I don't know if they felt they had to convict him for that because the hate crime laws are on the books or if they truly believe he did commit one in committing the other crimes he was charged with. It's all just a friggin' mess.
I guess at this point I'm of the mind that I'll decide how much of sympathy Ravi warrants when I find out what his sentence is. I just don't have much (if any) now. My lack of sympathy doesn't mean I take any joy in this. I just have no answers about any of it.
In many parts of this country, it's still okay and accepted to display open hostility and prejudice to people who are gay. Forget marriage granting civil rights - there are still a majority of states that don't protect gay people from being fired and evicted. If Ravi and Clemnti went to school in another state, who knows how this would have all played out. Do I think Ravi's conviction is going to fix any of that? No. Do I even know exactly what I'm trying to say at this point? No, I guess not.
"F**k my life. He's gay" is being treated like this damning, violent statement
I don't think anyone is isolating the statement as such. It was Ravi's excuse for the statement coupled with EVERYTHING else he said and did surrounding the event.
So no one punishes the homophobes. No one does anything about the people who taunt and tease and beat up gay men and lesbians and trans people.
But didn't hate crime legislation form BECAUSE it came to light and violent homophobes did get punished? No, not all of them get caught and not all of them get punished. That is true of every crime. OJ Simpson is living proof that the system is imperfect. So, should we just give up on the idea? I'm not comfortable with the idea that because so-and-so didn't go to jail, then this guy shouldn't either.
Ravi is treated like the most horrible person--the ONLY horrible person--and all the haters get to go on taunting and beating us up and calling us fags and dykes and trannies.
I'm not picking up on that AT ALL. The media has been shining a spotlight on suicides of gay youth as a result of bullying which has put this case in the forefront. When would be the appropriate time to start punishing for this crime? Never? I don't quite understand where you're going with this. Ravi is not being treated like the only horrible person. Which is why we've seen so much press on these types of cases. Which is why this case has had such a high profile.
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Posted: 3/23/12 at 05:43pm